Aug 27, 2024
Rereleasing one of DAT’s most popular episodes!
Dr. Dave Moghadam returns to the Dental A-Teampodcast! This time, he’s giving the goods on priority scheduling,something he’s been working with for over a year now. He and Kierago deep into priority scheduling with the following highlights:
How to map out ideal schedule
Keeping it flexible
Rolling out to the team
Space for emergencies
How hygiene fits in
And more!
About Dr. Moghadam:
Dr. Moghadam was born and raised in Morris County, NewJersey. After completing his undergraduate degree at RutgersUniversity in New Brunswick he went on to obtain his Doctor ofDental Medicine degree from the University of Medicine andDentistry (UMDNJ) in Newark. During his time at UMDNJ, Dr. Moghadamreceived extensive recognition for his outstanding leadership,academic and clinical aptitude, and dedication to the profession.Some of his achievements include receiving the William R. CinottiEndowed Scholarship and the American Student Dental AssociationAward of Excellence, as well as induction into the Gamma Pi DeltaProsthodontic Honor Society.
He then chose to complete a general practice residencyat Robert Wood Johnson University Hospital in New Brunswick wherehe received advanced training with an emphasis on comprehensiverestorative treatment, endodontics, and implantdentistry.
Episode resources:
Practice Momentum Group Consulting
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Transcript:
The Dental A Team (00:05.742)
Hey everyone, welcome to the Dental A Team podcast.I'm your host, Kiera Dent, and I had this crazy idea that maybe Icould combine a doctor and a team member's perspective, becauselet's face it, dentistry can be a challenging profession with thosetwo perspectives. I've been a dental assistant, treatmentcoordinator, scheduler, pillar, office manager, regional manager,practice owner, and I have a team of traveling consultants where wehave traveled to over 165 different offices coaching teams. Yep, wedon't just understand you, we are you.
Our mission is to positively impact the world ofdental. And I believe that this podcast is the greatest way I canhelp elevate teams, grow VIP experiences, reduce stress, and createA -Teams. Welcome to the Dental A Team Podcast.
The Dental A Team (00:51.438)
Hello, Dental A Team listeners, this is Kiera. And youguys, today I am so excited to have back on one of my favoritedoctors. He and I tend to come up with some fun ideas to podcaston. And so I'm super honored and grateful to have Dr. Dave Mogadamback on the show today. If you haven't heard, he and I have chattedso many different topics from mergers to practice to bringing onyour hygiene team and how to calibrate your hygiene team. And todaywe're gonna take it on another direction with scheduling. So Dave,how are you today?
I'm doing wonderful. How about yourself? Great andguys just so you know if you heard the last one Dave's got a killermustache going on again today He's got like I wish you guys couldsee him because he came like ready to go today rocking and rollingDave How's the weather where you're at today? I mean you've got themustache going on perfect haircut today I mean you're looking
You know, it was one of those things where I gotfooled in the Northeast. You know, we have these fake spring days.So yesterday was really, you know, beautiful, sunny, everythinglike that. So I threw on a T -shirt and a vest. I was walkingoutside this morning and somebody asked me where my sleeves are.It's freezing. Well, that's how we are over here. Today's thecoldest I think I've ever seen Reno and it's at 11 degrees today.And for me,
freezing cold. Like I don't know what this is. We alsohad that fake spring. was almost in the seventies and then plumbingit down, got lots of snow. So it's probably coming your way. So getready for it. Here it comes. But you know, here we go. So Dave,let's, let's dive right in. about, mean, you guys have a fun day.get customer service with Disney today. So just going to throw thatout there. That's going to be a fun day, but let's talk scheduling.I'm going to just tee everybody up for a possible otherconversation on customer service, Disney style,
Priority scheduling, you're a dentist, you guys havegrown a lot. Tiffany works with your practice, she's excited tocome see you again. So kind of walk us through this priorityscheduling and what you guys have found successful in yourpractice. So yeah, it's a really good topic. about a, a year agonow, I was really thinking about, know, what is going on with ourschedule? Because for years and years, as we've gotten busier,
The Dental A Team (03:07.126)
Monday through Wednesday has always been likegangbusters and awesome. And then we get to Thursday and it is justlike, my God, what is going on here? It's all the little ancillarynonsense that you just don't want to deal with. And everybody'srunning around and trying to deal with like seeing a bunch ofpatients and our practice is not really, you know, like that orgeared for that really. And you work harder, it's less fun andeverybody really just does not enjoy it, especially me. Right.
So for years and years, we've kind of always heard thebig consultant saying, you got to schedule to production and thisand that. And that just never really resonated with me in the leastbit. Because I always have this, and know my philosophy is aboutthis is kind of schedule everything else right, plan everythingelse well, do the right things, treat everybody the right way. Andthe numbers come. I feel like when we fixate on the numbers,it's
I don't know. just don't feel good about it. And Idon't think my team does either. But what I can get behind is,well, everybody wants to have a better experience at work. And whenmyself and the other doctor are happier, everybody else is happiertoo, because we're not just walking around like grumpy pants. SoI'd heard the idea of priority scheduling through a bunch of otherpodcasts. And I said, you know
think I can get behind this. know you guys had been abig proponent of actually managing the schedule, setting time outbetter, everything like that. So I sat down and I figured out, whatdoes an ideal week look like? What type of procedures do I want todo? How do I want to break them up? How do we set up time where theflow of everything's better? Where do we put in the ancillary stuffso it's not something where we spend one day running around and wejust end the week on just like a ugh.
kind of note there. So we started doing this, think,last March. And it could be the perfect storm. It could be a lot offactors. But between that, ramping up our marketing, everythinglike that, all of sudden that month, we were basically up maybe 20,30 percent. And we've pretty consistently been doing that, exceptfor not the last couple of months. Hashtag COVID. So, what are yougoing to do? That has more to do
The Dental A Team (05:30.216)
all the other factors that come into place of, youknow, switching, switching over associates, switching overhygienists, all the lovely stuff that, you know, puts all thepressure on myself and the rest of the wonderful team here. Right.We're doing it. So I love that. And I love that you brought that upof you. Number one, I think it's really impressive that you're adentist, you're the doctor, and you're the one who thinks throughthis. Because while yes, teams can do it. And I encourage teams tothink like this if your doctors don't.
But Dave, I love that you're always a very proactivedentist. You are always thinking about like, okay, what causesthis? And instead of just focusing on the symptoms, you go to theroot cause. Like what is causing us to have Thursdays that aren'tas productive? What is causing us to have successful Mondaysthrough Wednesdays? And what can we do to change that? And I thenlove that you went and took this to like, what would my idealschedule be? Because as a team member, that's literally what I needfrom you. I need to know what my doctor prefers. Because I can puttogether a schedule
But I know working with hundreds of dentists likeKiera Dent knows that not every dentist likes to practice the sameway. Some doctors love to rock and roll until about noon and thenlike just fill it with fluff at the end of the day. They do notwant anything hard. They don't want to be doing any production.Other doctors like, nope, that's when I like to do my surgeries,put my surgeries in at the end of the day. And so it really isparamount for our dentists to give us this like ideal schedule ofwhat they want. And then we can word Ninja as team members.
I Dr. Dave loves to see his patients for thisprocedure at this time. So there's a lot of different ways we coulddo it, but how did you kind of come up with your ideal schedulethat you actually wanted to do? Like, how did you even map thatout? Cause I think sometimes people are like, well, I don't, don'tactually know what I want or how much I want to produce. Like, didyou have only the type of procedures that was going to be ideal foryou? Or did you have the dollar amount that was going to be idealfor you? Like, how did you build this out for priority scheduling?Yeah. Now I only did it based on the type of procedures. Iactually,
zero thought to the dollar amounts. I think, you know,it kind of all comes full circle and just kind of the way that wedo everything here. And it's going to be super different in everyoffice. And I mean, I've shared my template that I made in Excelwith, you know, other friends and stuff like that, but it's notgoing to work for other other offices for a variety of reasons. Iam very different than
The Dental A Team (07:49.228)
the guy next door or across the country and everythinglike that. And I mean that in a positive way. We all have ourstrong suits. We all have what we like to do. We all have whatmakes us successful and how we want to go ahead and practice. Justlike you guys can't walk in and give somebody a cookie cuttertemplate for consulting. It's the same thing here. So I thinkreally, how did I figure out how to do it? What do I want to do?What do I find is helpful? What do we have a demand for in ourpractice?
I mean, these are all factors that come into play.mean, I could love to, let's pick like a random procedure. mean, Icould love to do immediate dentures every single day, but unlessI'm in a place where we're just a denture -lating every humanbeing, like that's not gonna happen. So it's a matter of takinglike all these factors into account, figuring out what works andthen kind of some of the logistics, like what is different ondifferent days? We have a wonderful, wonderful dental assistantwho's with us only on Wednesdays and has been for forever.
and she takes care of all our denture stuff. She'llmake flippers immediately for patients in the chair. She'll addteeth. She'll turn partials into dentures, stuff like that. SoWednesday mornings is when I'm lining up a lot of my setting up herimplant kind of cases or just big extraction cases, things likethat, where it's kind of like in a pinch, we can do the extractionand grafting. She can give them something temporary or stuff likethat. So a lot of that stuff, we just kind of line
things like that up that way. Other than that, I mean,I like to go ahead and get the day started with at least somethingmoderately, you know, productive. So, you know, the way we docrowns in our office, we do them in a single visit. So, you know,it's either, it's going to be a block, like, you know, we startwith that. The next hour is going to be, you know, somethingsmaller space for emergency. and then, you know, kind of sprinklethings out throughout the day, having blocks where it's just goingto be just longer, you know, quadrant kind of stuff.
So I mean, that's the starting point. But the I thinkthe big thing for, you know, doctors and team members listening islike, yeah, this is like the template. But it doesn't mean likeit's it's set in stone. And if you don't get anything a day before,like tell everybody else to take a hike. Right. I mean, it's amatter of having that kind of idea of like, what makes sense foryou guys is it 24 hours?
The Dental A Team (10:08.494)
48 hours before where we're going to go ahead and justbasically put either whatever or switch it up. Or if we're like aweek out and we really got to get somebody in, let's switch theblock, but then let's make sure we change it in the surroundingareas to accommodate for things so we don't have, you know, weirdodd dead space. Right. Exactly. And I think that's a key piece thatI feel like a lot of people almost become robotic when you do havethese blocks in there. And it's like only put filling here.
And it's like, no, no, no, guys, like we still need toutilize our brains and we need to think of what's going to be thebest flow for our patients and also for our practice. And you'reright for me, my standard is typically 24 hours before I don't putanything in that block or that space because my goal is to try andfill it. I also think it's really important. I know as a treatmentcoordinator, I just like I was, was building a puzzle piece all daylong. So patients, almost saw them as puzzle pieces and where couldI fit this patient?
to fit with all the rest of the patients to make areally beautiful schedule. And so if somebody walked up and theysaid, okay, I'm fillings today, but I know I've got a bigger block,I'm not gonna stick this puzzle piece in the big block because it'snot gonna fill that space. So I'm really looking to put thispatient in where it's going to work best for our practice and alsofor the patient. But so often I think team members are like, well,this filling wants tomorrow, Kiera. And I'm like, well, yes.
A child also wants candy every day for dinner too. Andso just because the patient says they want that, what theyultimately want is a great experience. And as a team, what weultimately want is a great experience. So let's kind of word ninja,help the patient realize like, hey, Dr. Dave actually prefers to dohis fillings at this time. Let's reserve this for you. So that wayI'm really doing it. Also guys, like I'm gonna give some tips tothe front office and for all team members scheduling, cause I'malso not just pro front office, but also back office.
Please like don't set yourself up for failure bysaying what day works best for you. Because as soon as you openthat floodgate, that patient's gonna tell you what they wouldprefer. That then you get into a pickle. Like what if we only havethis assistant on Wednesdays that does this procedure, but theysaid Tuesday? Well now I've gotta tell them the great news of, ourassistant's amazing and she's only in on Wednesday, so we gottaschedule you on Wednesday, but they just told me they want Tuesday,so I'm already in a losing battle.
The Dental A Team (12:25.038)
be proactive and say, fantastic, Dr. Dave loves to dohis implants on Wednesdays. Let's get a time reserved. I've got 9 aor 3 p What works best for you? So that way I'm being directive onthe conversation as well. It's going to help minimize thatfrustration and also make scheduling a lot easier in that priorityscheduling. So I think the 24 hour rule before and then also makingsure we're as team members setting it up as well so we're nothaving frustrated patients merely because of how we ask thequestions rather than guiding
the conversation. So Dave, I'm curious when you builtthis schedule out, did you kind of do a rough draft and then takeit to the team and ask them of what they thought? Or was it, Hey,let's try this out. How did you roll this to the team? Cause Ithink a lot of doctors worry that they'll, that they'll ruffle somefeathers with the team members. So how did you roll this out toyour team to get some solid buy -in from it as well? So the way weactually ended up doing this in the first round, it was myself.
my previous associate and my office manager sat downand kind of did, you know, the, the two doctor schedules. And itwas nice to do that. because I mean, I'm just going to probably belike, I just wanted to do this. And then, you know, they'll have tolike reel me into be like that. Just, just probably prettyinappropriate.
It's true. Doctors always think that they can getthings done so fast. They're like, yeah, I could get that crowndone in 30 minutes. And I'm like, I'll be honest, it's going totake you at least 45 minutes. Like, I've watched you for the lastfive years. Like, I know your schedule, doctor. So it's good tohave somebody balance you out that knows a reality check on it aswell. So I think that's a thing. You definitely need at least oneother person to either look through it, talk through it. I think ifyou get everybody involved, you get too many cooks in the kitchen,that's generally
like pretty unhelpful. there's that to it. But theother things to take into account and everything like that is like,let's say different doctors have different skill sets andeverything like that. Well, you kind of have to really take intoaccount like, well, you know, if this doctor is the only one whocan do these procedures, we need space for that and this and that.And, you know, if this doctor only does, you know, these types ofthings, there needs to be more variety in things.
The Dental A Team (14:40.702)
as a result, you know, I hear a lot of, Dr. Dave, likewe, can't get this patient in for a filling with you for XYZ time.And I'm just like, yup. -huh. That's okay. It's just like, it'sokay. Like, you know, it's, one of those things. And like, that wasa big, yeah, a little, little bit of a tricky situation. We were ina pension the last couple of months where we've been, much moreshorthanded, but now that we're trying to grow another scheduleagain and balance everything out and as our, newer.
doctor in the practice is growing her skill set andincorporating more things and it's actually perfect. Totally. And Ithink you were really wise in saying to one, bring the otherassociate, if there's another doctor and an office manager, like afront office scheduler, whomever that is in your practice, becauseyou guys then are going to really build a really beautiful puzzletogether of where it goes. I remember I had an office and, therewere two doctors who could both do root canals. However,logistically speaking, they only had.
one set of root canal equipment in the practice. Sofor us to ever schedule double root canals at the same time, andthis was a pretty root canal heavy practice, they had to get reallysmart of where can we put this to make sure, and same thing likewith utilizing a mill. If you only have one mill, you don't want tohave two doctors doing two crowns at the same time, because thenyou're going to get into a mill issue. And so I agree, I think it'sjust really smart how you guys did that. And then also being ableto pivot with your team.
I love that you've held the line though of like, Dr.Dave, we don't have a spot to put a filling. Like team members needto realize that it's okay. An ideal schedule for us, priorityscheduling for our team does not mean we're doing a disservice toour patients. I have found that when we create chaos for our team,that does not give a good patient experience, nor does it give agood team experience. And so really being okay to say, hey, thisdoesn't, like we have this spot available for you.
versus it being like, let me try and shove a fillingin and we're gonna try and make this schedule work. Like scheduleshould not be work in my opinion, they should flow. Yes, you needto be creative. Yes, you need to look for those puzzle pieces andfill them in. Be proactive, make those extra phone calls. Don'tjust wait for the patient to show up, like proactively call, lookthrough. Guys, I don't know if you know, but on unscheduledtreatment plans, you literally can filter by procedure code. And soyou can actually go look like if I know I need a crown, I cansort
The Dental A Team (17:04.694)
my list of unscheduled treatment and find all thecrown patients and contact those patients. Again, I'm looking for acertain puzzle piece. I'm not going to just get any puzzle piece. Iwant that certain one so I can make those strategic phone callsmaximize my time. So Dave, I love that you built this out. I lovethat you shared and I love that you really prioritized your teamand what you guys wanted. And then we're able to fill the patientsin. Like I said, like puzzle pieces trying to make a beautifulschedule and it really is doable.
It just requires, I think the whole team to be onboard and bought in. Otherwise it gets pure mayhem. Like if oneperson's doing it, but the other person's not in the front office,it gets wild. And so everybody needs to play by, by the rules. AndI think there's great success. Any other tips you've got onpriority scheduling, Dave, you've shared so much already. thankyou. mean, I got, I got a handful. can, we can all right. I think,I think another thing to take into account here, just like witheverything else, you got it. You got to take it with a grain of
You know, if you have a long established patient whocan only come at 8 a and needs a filling, the patient in. Like,know what saying? You got to give your team that flexibility andthat leeway and saying like, look, this is this. And just kind of,they give me a heads up of like, it's so -and -so, like we had todo it. like, okay, like it is what it is. Like, you know, change itup, do this. Like, you know, we're going to make it work because atthe end of the day, our patients are our priority. You know, asmuch as like it's great if we can go ahead and word ninja thingsand shift everybody around and everything like
That's not always possible. That's not always, youknow, the thing in every practice. I mean, it's, it's, it's nice ifwe can, we can do it, but you know, there has to be leeway andflexibility. And the only thing I ask of everybody is, okay, justtell me what's up and change the, blocks, shift some stuff around.So things match up. So it's not like, you know, we have like an oddlike wall or like, you know, nothing going on. And, know, at theend of the day, depending on where you are in your, your practicelife cycle and what's going on sometimes having.
blocked out space and time is actually really helpfulto help, you know, get emergencies and grow things and stuff likethat. So for sure, not always the end of the world. I could usemore time sitting at my desk. I know, but then we feel like as teammembers, our doctor goes to what I call like the black hole, likeyou guys going to your office. I'm like, then I'll never get youback. but I think it's one of those pieces. Also, I think youbrought up a good point. I think so many offices forget to findspace for emergencies. cause guess
The Dental A Team (19:28.12)
there will always be emergencies and emergencies canactually be super great in a schedule. I actually loved emergenciesbecause they're great same day treatment. They're greatopportunities. It's great to be able to help patients. And so Ithink that that's a good piece to actually build into your scheduletemplate of where you actually want these emergencies to go. Guesswhat guys, when somebody's in pain, they will come wherever youtell them they can come if they're truly in an emergencysituation.
They do not need your 8 a They do not need your 4 pLike if they are truly in pain, they will show up at whatever timeyou have. So I think it's very paramount to get those emergenciesin there as well because that will throw an entire day for yourteam if there's not emergency space in that schedule to fill it in.So agreed with you. I don't like long walls, but I definitely liketo plan for those emergencies when we would like to see
Yeah, I think it's super, super helpful. I think atthe end of the day, also something that I've always been a bigproponent of, what we consider an emergency appointment in ouroffice is very rarely kind of like, Hey, this is what's going onhere. Subscription or let's reschedule. It's kind of, it's reallyalong the lines of if it's something that we can do without, youknow, having any type of negative impact on our other patients andthe flow of everything else, we're going to do it. I've been bigproponent of
If the tooth needs to come out and wants to come out,there's no way we're not going to work that in because if you dothis for a while, it doesn't take that long. Somebody canunderstand and be pretty patient and say, hey, I'm going to work inthe schedule. I definitely want to help you out. have a lot elsegoing on, but if you can hang out for half an
you know, 40 minutes, I got to take care of a coupleof the things first. I will get you all set today rather than like,yeah, let's schedule you in, you know, two weeks. And then, youknow, by that point, you know, there's still in the schedule, butthey saw somebody else and, know, you have, same thing with, with,know, a crown if you can, I mean, why not? Like, you know, prep it,temp it, you know, take your impression, get everything all set,take your scan, you know, make the crown, whatever you do in youroffice. Like if you can work it in the schedule, if somebody'spatient,
The Dental A Team (21:32.45)
Like why not get that done the same day? think that'sdoing that is what, you know, I feel like really built our practicein the first couple of years that I was here. I love doing stufflike that. I love trying to help somebody out the same day. Peoplereally appreciate it. And that's what's really going to buildgoodwill. Exactly. That's, that's raving fans right there. Yeah.Yeah. I love same day treatment, same day treatment. I heard aquote once I said, what's the most productive chair in a practice.And it was an empty chair.
because that's the chair that you can flip. Like don'tprefer to have my schedule have empty chairs. But let's be honest,like that same day treatment is always very, very, very beneficialfor patients. Like I feel like that's a VIP customer service thatwe can offer. And so I love that you've built a culture of a teamthat if we can do it, we will say yes. And we're always looking forhow we can say yes versus how we can't say yes. I know I've sharedthis with so many practices
There's the I just say with same day treatment, it'sall about timing. You've got to be really quick and we've got to beable to say yes, because a window is only so big and it only lastsfor so long with same day treatment opportunities. So beingproactive and like let's say yes sooner than later, becausehonestly, if I can have the patient say yes and have the financialsdone while Dr. Dave's in the chair with me, he can get the patientnumb that can move along a lot quicker. I can be taking all of myprelim work and with crowns, I think it's also important
especially for same day, you don't have to do A to Zthe entire way. Like you don't have to complete the crown if wedon't have time. Like you said, you could temp a crown and bringthem back and you can mill it and seed it. If you've got time tomill it and seed same day, fantastic. But I think especially withthose same day emergencies, like say yes, but realize we can do, wedon't have to do the entire process. We can still get them out ofpain as other alternatives to being able to say yes. I know we didsame day crowns all the time.
but I also had very minimal chairs and we were alwayslike very packed with all those chairs. So instead of like takingup a huge chunk of time while that crown was milling, we wouldtempt them sometimes and send them out and bring them back for acrown seat on a day where I had space for that. It wasn't mypreferred, but that was a way we were able to help a lot morepatients within the confines of our practice. We only had fivechairs. I was running three doctor chairs and they were all jampacked cause I had Eddas.
The Dental A Team (23:55.246)
It's like little mini dentists all the time. So I wasliterally implant, implant crown. So there wasn't a lot of space onchair time because I had another surgery coming right after, butthere's still like, wanted to paint that picture because no matterwhat your practice is, you can still say yes to same day and trainyour team to say yes and say it quickly. That way you guys can helpmore patients same day. Yeah. So, so, so a couple of things withthat. Yeah. If you can expand your facility to be able toaccommodate things,
one, it makes things very easy and stuff like that.Like I don't, I don't, I won't, almost never make temporariesbecause of that, because we have an extra chair and stuff likethat. the crazy thing with that is, you know, you're going to spenda lot of money on doing things. You're going to be like me who,has, you know, walls being knocked down and your office is a duststorm and has to have to stand in your attic to do a podcast. Warzone right now.
But, know, I'm a little nuts. I think it's worth it.You know, that's all part of it. I think the other thing that, youknow, I really want to make sure that we clarify is don't say yesif you can't say yes. Like don't make it a not good experience for,you know, your other patients, respect everybody. Don't rushyourself. You know, do what you can do within the confines ofthings. It's just my philosophies of, you know, let's try and makeit work if we can to try and help somebody out within reason.
Hello, Dental A Team listeners. What would it take foryou guys to just completely and utterly change your practice? Liketruly, if you think about it, because for me, I know oftentimesit's just having somebody right by my side, pushing me along,holding me accountable, having somebody to spin ideas off of. Andhonestly, that's all it takes most of the time for us to go fromgood to great. Usually it's taking the knowledge that we learn andactually executing
That's why I would love to invite you to join ourPlatinum Virtual, where we do a coaching call, a Zoom teamtraining. We invite you to our community and we just really divedeep with you. We're that partner right by you to help you go fromgood to great. So if you're wanting to join, take your practice tothe next level and you know it's time for you to implement,execute, and go to that next level, email usHello@TheDentalATeam.com. And I would be so excited to welcome youas our newest Platinum Virtual member. Can't wait to see youthere.
The Dental A Team (26:15.636)
Agreed and thank you for that clarifying because theworst thing that I see is people are like, okay, we're going to sayyes to same day treatment, but that ends up messing up the schedulefor all the other patients that were scheduled that were comingthat came on time. And that also is not VIP care. So you're right.It's kind of this nice healthy balance. but I have found that teammembers who are, are quicker team members that have the philosophyof, will say yes as often as possible within reason.
they just think quicker. Like I know we could have acrown prep set up within like less than like two, two ish minutes.Like I was like, doc, numb, I'll have this whole room set up foryou and come right back. And so I think it's that mindset of, knowI need to move quick cause I don't want to throw the rest of myschedule off. But like you said, never, ever, ever compromisingcare. Cause I think some people can get caught up in that and thendentistry is not as good. And that, doesn't actually serve thepatient longterm either.
You want to talk about the other side of priorityscheduling? Yes, I do. Take it away, Dave. Hygiene. Yes. All Sothis is something you probably have a better scope and handle onme. I'm pretty sure you guys were the ones who a long time agostarted kind of pushing me more towards the lines of make sure thatyou put blocks in for new patients and
You know, you could do separate blocks. You could dothe same kind of blocks. You just need space to be able to helpsomebody. The worst thing in the world is like, hey, you have thiscrazy disease, but guess what? We'll see in three months to try andaddress the situation. Super important, right? It great. It makesme laugh every time. Every time. Like, man, you've got this liketerrible disease. We've got to take care of it. I can't see you forsix months. Cool. All right. I mean, it sounds real serious. Yeah.Yeah. Like we just told somebody their teeth are going to fall outof their head.
and we can't see them for a while. Wonderful. No, itdoes not go well ever. Yeah. So I think that's one big thing. Ithink that is one of the handful of things that really helped usgrow as far as being able to get more new patients was actuallybeing able to see them and fit them in the schedule rather thankind of like we have this jam -packed hygiene schedule of oneprophy after the other. You know, it helps create variety, helpsmix things up, it helps grow things in your office.
The Dental A Team (28:32.398)
last couple of months of kind of not having thosespaces have really helped me realize, you know, yeah, you can gofrom seeing on average 50 new patients a month to 20 when you don'thave any space to put anybody and you don't have the providers tosee them. it sucks for sure. I think that that's people always askme that, Kiera, how many new patient spots do I hold? And I say, golook at your schedule, see how many new patients you've got. Andyou've got to, as a minimum, have that many spaces in your
that are held for these new patients to come throughbecause they will keep calling. And new patients, if you don't havespace, they might wait for you, but they also might go somewhereelse, depending upon the dynamics around your practice. If you'rein a busy area that's got lots of dentists, they're probably notgoing to wait that month or two to come see you. And so I agree. Itypically say, guys, build it out, however many spaces you need fornew patients. Let's get that
And then also get creative because I know there's somepeople who listen and they think, well, new patients should go inthe doctor's schedule. And there's other people that think newpatients should go in the hygiene schedule. And what I will say isboth ways work great. They both can. I would say if you don't haveany new patient spaces in your hygiene schedule, but you did blockthem, like I'm going to give you this caveat. If you're notblocking them, start blocking first. But if you are, sometimes somedoctors will have those new patients come through on the doctor'sside, make it a shorter appointment and have that hygienist come inand.
you can swap it out while they're doing an exam. Butthat way you can still see those patients on the doctor side for amuch shorter appointment and just let them. I think some goodverbiage on that is like hey, Doctor Dave loves his new patients somuch and he wants to make sure he sees you. So we're going to getyou in on his schedule and something opens up for you to get acleaning same day. Fantastic, but we want to make sure we get youin that way. Doctor Dave can see you find out what kind of cleaningyou need and that's a great way if you have that. But then next
block more spaces and people say, Kiera, we're bookedout for six months, hygiene's booked out for six months. And Iliterally tell you guys, start putting blocks in today. There isspace where patients have fallen off and start holding all of thosespots as they do fall off for new patients to come through and thenget those blocks in for six months. as you are scheduling out thenext six months, you're making your life better in the future thannot. So Dave, how do you guys do it? Do you hold it only for newpatients or do you do new patients and SRPs? What's kind of beenyour magic?
The Dental A Team (30:53.208)
formula you've found in your practice? I can't saythat we have the magic here. It's a work in progress. I think we'vekind of just been doing longer blocks to accommodate for both. Ithink something that I've been toying with more so lately to kindof get to your other point of like, you put them in the doctor'sschedule, the hygiene schedule, stuff like that? If we're doing agood job,
in the front office and really asking the rightquestions. And once again, that goes with a grain of salt becausemy front office team does do a good job and they do ask the rightquestions, but sometimes, you know, the patients will tell ussomething that's insane and doesn't really match. But the point I'mtrying to get to here is like, if somebody hasn't been in like 10years and they're in their, you know, forties, fifties, and they,you know, they're giving you signs that very likely it's, you know,a potential train wreck, probably not gonna do
the hygiene visit that day anyway. But if you have anhour in hygiene and said to that hour and a half, like why not justgo ahead and help them form that relationship with the hygienistand say, know, we're going to go ahead. It sounds like there may bea lot going on. We're going to get you in. We're going to take afull set of records. The doctor's going to come in and you know,you guys are going to work through kind of putting the plantogether and we're going to go ahead and go from there. But youknow, with the, with what it sounds like, you know, your situationis we really want to make sure that we, take a pause here.
We take a second, we make sure we evaluate everythingwell and then go from there. Now, mean, they very well, theirperiodontal status could be perfectly fine. It happens, you know,where that's the situation. But, you know, at the end of the day,it's not something where somebody is expecting like, my God, I'mgonna go ahead and do that. Most patients who haven't been in 10years, they know they haven't been in 10 years. They expect thingsto be a little bit of a mess. Sometimes,
they're perfectly fine, you that happens, but atleast, you know, it wasn't something where their expectation waslike, my God, I was going to get everything done. And like, this isall you guys did. Right. And I think, like you said, the biggestpiece I hope everybody's taking from here is it's all about how yousay things and you manage people's expectations. And so I thinkit's really important to, help them realize like, we're going totake great care of you. we're going to do a great, thorough exam onyou and we're going to come up with a game plan together. And Iwould say to the hygienist.
The Dental A Team (33:16.334)
I know that sometimes patients come through that wethink are going to be perio and I know it's not the most idealtimeframe where you're like, I only have 45 minutes and I reallyneed an hour and a half. What I would say that I've seen with lotsof other hygienists and Brittany and Dana both would attest tothis, they're both hygienists. I think hygienists back to our sameday treatment, let's see what you could do. Is there a zone thatyou could do? Could you do a debridement? Could you do maybe justone quad? Could
and start looking for those things and seeing howcould you say yes to help this patient? Because at the end of theday, you have 45 minutes. And if we send them away and try and getthem scheduled back, yes, that can happen. But at the same time,could you maximize their time and your chair time to help thatpatient out, at least in a small way? Now get it. I understandinsurance is crazy. And you're going to give me all these otherreasons that things can't work. I will tell you that there are alot of opportunities that we could do. So look to see what couldyou do during that time frame. And is there a way that you
you can help this patient out so you're maximizingtheir time and your time as well. Yeah, think you bring up somereally great points and some things that more so recently we'vebeen thinking about and pivoting towards. It used to be like a bigwaste of time, honestly, in our hygiene schedule. Like we have anhour and a half hygiene appointment, they need scaling or rootplanning. let's set this up. Like, are they gonna come back? When'sit gonna be? Rather than, hey,
you know, this is what the situation is at this point,the patient is as bought into it. I'm most concerned about thissection over here. Let's go ahead and let's get you started atleast here. Let's get things moving in the right direction andlet's get you set up, you know, in two weeks to go ahead and goahead and do these two areas. And then we'll finish off with, withthis one rather than just kind of like waiting and hoping, I got todo like one half now and run half the other day. Like, let's sayit's going to be, you know, two to three visits, like let's showthem like, Hey, that this area is that's worse.
We're going to focus on just that by itself. mean, Idon't, you know, I think if you explain things in the appropriateway, that builds a lot more value than kind of like somebody notcoming, you know, somebody coming back one more time, like, great,they're still investing the same amount, but it shows that you'reinvesting more in them in a sense, because you're going topotentially, you know, spend extra time. For sure. And I think thatthat's just the piece of like, I guess you said that they have anhour and a half, but they need quads of
The Dental A Team (35:36.11)
Just do something. You have the time, so please dosomething. And I know you're going to say, but Kiera, insuranceonly covers this. Guys, I want to put out a really big piece. Likemost periopatients have more going on than just SRPs. So odds arethey're probably going to max their insurance anyway. I'm 99 .9 %sure that almost every single periopatient has more going on. Andat the same time, I'm going to work with that patient financiallyto make sure that it actually works and we do maximize theirbenefits. But please,
Like don't waste an hour of that patient's time inyour chair time because we're so concerned about insurance. Likethere are a thousand ways that we can work around that. Because atthe end of the day, like let's not let insurance dictate what we dofor our patient. Let's make sure we're taking great care of ourpatients as well. So I love it, Dave. I'm glad you and I are on thesame page. If you guys could have seen my face when he said, Idon't have to have, I was like, my gosh, like don't even say that.Find the way to say yes, because like you said,
You just told this patient they have ferio disease andyou have some time that you could start in an area like let's takecare of them and let's see how we could say yes versus not,especially where hygiene is booked out so far. Hygienists are hardto find. We would love to have an ideal schedule, but it's like howcould we maximize the hygienist time and the patient's time todaywithout compromising care? So it's always with the caveat of likelet's not compromise care, but could we say yes in some of theseareas? And I think if we really were all honest with ourselves.
we could say yes more often than we probably do and wecan help our patients. That's at least my thoughts. I think that'sthe big thing too. I think, you know, we, a lot of times we'll makea lot of excuses in situations and sometimes they're valid,sometimes they're not. I think really at the end of the day,everybody being on the same page in the sense of kind of what isbest for the patient, how we want to do things and what ourphilosophies and mentalities are about, you know, patienttreatment
and care. And, you know, at end of the day, this alsotakes the right team members. If somebody wants to just kind of bethere, punch the clock, mail it in and gets annoyed that like, myGod, like, you know, just do the other two sealants, you still havehalf an hour, like don't bring them back and kill time andschedule. That's not the right team member. And sometimes that'shard.
The Dental A Team (37:58.482)
know, sealants, floor, like those are allopportunities that taking impressions or scans for night guards,like taking scans for ortho. Like there are so many ways that wecould maximize that hour. And I will say, hygienist, I will go tobat for you all day long to protect your hour appointment. Withthat said, I will also go to bat that hygienist. You do maximizethat hour and you are productive with that hour as well. You lookfor opportunities that you can do same day as often as possible.And I agree with you, Dave, I think it's important.
to have the right team members. So I'm curious fromyour stance, like you've hired a lot of people, you've transitioneda lot of people. How do you, I mean, you're hiring new people now.What are some tips that you've found to possibly like set the tonethat this is our culture, this is what we do to find these peoplethat are like, yes, like drivers, gunners, like I am totally goingto say yes. Any tips you've got on how to find those people andcreate that culture? I wish I had like a real good answer for youbecause I mean, I could use that knowledge and so every other.
you know, office owner in the entire country. I mean,I think, I think it's really, it's, very difficult right now. It'salways difficult in general, honestly. I think, you know, as I kindof do some soul searching on the, topic here and really kind of,you know, really kind of dive into it there, just being veryupfront about kind of what your practice is, what your expectationsare, and really kind
weighing it all out there, not being afraid. Like, myGod, am I going to scare this person? Because at the end of theday, if they come in with the preconceived notion of like, hey,this is going to be like this, and then like they see, yeah, sh*t,this is like very intense. I've been trying, I've tried the lastfive episodes, not to swear. Like biggest like potty mouth ever.I'm impressed. mean, was the editor some work to do here. No, it'sbecause we're talking about team and the frustration of team. Itjust comes out. I get it. I've definitely -
I might have said a word or two myself. You'realready. That's the thing. You can ask Tip how much I swear when Italk to her. This is like every other word is something there.Anyway, not to get sidetracked. I mean, I think it's a matter ofreally setting the tone and the expectation of, this is how we are.This is our practice. Because at the end of the day, we've alwaysbeen able to find pretty good people based on how they interactwith each other and what our culture is like and everything likethat. But if somebody doesn't want to really
The Dental A Team (40:21.186)
work and really get everything going and stuff likethat. It's, well, you know, at the end of the day, we're, buyingtime until it's going to transition out. Totally. Cause for us,it's really important to, to work hard, to grow, to learn, to spendthe time doing training, to sit through all the meetings that wedo, to, try and really, you know, work on, work on you as a personand a part of the team. But if somebody just kind of says like, myGod, this is amazing for a year. And then it's kind
wreaking havoc and punching the clock for anotheryear, that actually had more of a negative impact than a positive.Well, for sure, because it sets the tone to the team that everybodyelse can do this. I remember another fantastic quote, guys. I'm notquoting all over here, but I don't know who says it. So go find outwho said this. This was not me. But they said, the worst thing thata manager or a leader could do to good team members. So the worstthing we can do to good team members is tolerate poor performancefrom another team member.
Because what it does is it just tells those great teammembers like hey, we actually don't care We're going to allow thisother team member just to be a punch like a clock puncher where Iexpect you to stay super like proactive so I think when I I Heardthat I thought as a manager like that is my job I need to make sureall of my team members are at the same level understanding thateverybody has their own levels as well But I agree with you Dave. Ithink that that's the biggest thing I found I remember when I washiring and we
late hours. I used to try and like sugarcoat it andI'd be like, yeah, so like maybe. And what I realized is they camein expecting not to work these evening hours. Then all my team thatwas there that was working evening hours were livid. That newperson hired gets off at five o 'clock and they're here till sevenor seven thirty. And so I just found like, just throw your dirtylaundry out there. But I don't think culture is dirty laundry. Ithink that's a hey, it's kind of like dating. And I'm like, hey,this is who I am and I'm not going to sugarcoat who I
does this vibe and jive with you? And if it doesn't,like high five, you're gonna find somewhere that does vibe and jivewith you. But we're an office that is like super passionate aboutgrowing ourselves. We're an office that says yes to same daytreatment all the time. We're the office that busts our buns allday long and we love it we get a freaking high on it and we allwish we could wear roller skates so we could actually see morepatients. Like does that lifestyle work for you? And then also giveme an example of how you've done this at your past practice.And
The Dental A Team (42:42.808)
quick things that are going to put them on the spot.As I found like rogue questions, people have, they've got answersfor you, but I'll ask them on the spot. Like one of my favoritequestions is, what's the worst thing anybody would say about you atyour last practice and why? And people are like, but they have togive me an answer right then and there. And I'm going to find outalso a trick question is what's your biggest pet peeve of otherteam members and what they tell
is what they are because we only see in other peoplewho we are. So that's kind of anything. If people say, I can'tstand lazy team members, odds are this person's probably going tobe a lazy team member. Not all the time. It's not like a fail proofquestion. But some of those things I think can really help. Butlike you said, Dave, I think it's so paramount to say this is whoour team is. Also have your team members interview them and seewhat they think. because
when a person comes in and they see the whole team isjiving, the whole team does same day treatment, the whole team isthis way. One, they're either going to level up and rise to thatoccasion or two, they'll be like, this is not what I want to do.And that's okay. Let them find their dream job and you find yourdream employee as well. I that's, I think that's a big part of it.I think another thing is, you look at the end of the day,
I am a lot of the personality of my office and it tookme maybe a long time to understand that and be okay with sayingthat and just be like, no big deal, but that's it. So if they arenot really okay with how intense and passionate I am about certainthings and this and that, and they're gonna not be happy with like,okay, we need to do this. That's just not gonna work, sorry.
And we kind of fool ourselves and we kind of buy timebecause we worry about like, what are we going to do? Like beingshorthanded, but I mean, been shorthanded for like three years now.mean, it's always that fear of the unknown, but I'm like, guys,we've actually been in the unknown. You just forgot that you'velived there for quite a while. Like it's totally fine. Don'tstress. I love that you just said that Dave, cause I think so manydoctors, so many managers, I'm like, know thyself and be free anddon't be afraid of it because guess what? They're going to see yourtrue colors.
The Dental A Team (44:50.654)
They're going to see what it's like and I'd muchrather present exactly how I am I tell people I'm like do you wantto work with me? I'm a pretty intense boss I have the higheststandards you will ever come across and I don't sugarcoat if thatdoesn't jive and vibe with you It's cool. Let's high five and moveon because that's what I will expect of you and then Don't beafraid and I say this because I just had to do it myself Don't beafraid that if people aren't performing to the level you want andyou can see they're writing on the wall it's time to have thatconversation sooner than later and don't be afraid
of what your team will do. Cause I promise you, yourteam will like, they'll rise up, they'll figure it out. They'llpivot with you if they're the right team members, but don't, don'thold onto team members longer than you know, should. Yeah. thinkanother thing also is, know, as things have changed and, now we'rethere, there are people who are coming into dentistry who don'treally know much about dentistry or what it is. I found
probably most helpful in one of our most recent hires,which is our new assistant who assists me, who's been with us forthe last two months. Before she even came in for an interview, Ispent about half an hour on the phone trying to tell her how bad ofa job being a dental assistant is. And really just kind of saying,look, at the end of the day, it is very difficult work. You mayfeel underappreciated because it's so
and days are hard and what we do is sometimesthankless. And you know, there's a lot that goes into that. I needyou to understand that before you even walk in the door. If you'renot going to be okay with that, it doesn't mean that I don'tappreciate you. doesn't mean our patients don't appreciate you.That is just what happens. Right. So if somebody's not going to beokay with that, then like, this is not like a new career path totry and like hop into.
I think if somebody understands that and they they'repassionate about things they want to learn they want to go theywant to create a new thing great let's do it I will teach you morehere than you'll learn anywhere else. Which I think is brilliantand it's funny because Liz she is my coach and she actuallyinterviews all of our consultants and Liz and I are a good duo Ilike people to like me and Liz is more direct because she has noskin in the game and she knows the skin in the game is my happinessand stress level.
The Dental A Team (47:03.534)
And Liz will literally talk to consultants and tellthem the worst terrible experiences. She's like, are you OK to beon the road 80 % of the time away from your family? That means fourout of the five days. Are you like? How do you feel getting stuckin an airport having to spend the night? Your flights are canceledbecause of weather and you can't get to your office like you don'teat for three days and I'm like, Liz, don't make and she's like noKiera. I'd rather make this sound so awful and see if they're stillwilling to have that grit to come back. She's like because at theend of the day.
A consultant has to have grit. They have to havepivot. They have to have that stamina. And I'd much rather have itbe like the most like horrifying interview. And if they're like,yep, no problem. Like Britt, Britt, haven't met her yet, Dave, butBritt is somebody like, it's fine. I actually ended up gettingstuck in another country because my friend had appendicitis. LikeI'm totally good. And I'm like, that's even like more than I've gotin my travel, travel life. She's like, I'm totally good. So I thinkit's important, like you said, really lay it out of not the besthighlight reel.
of the job, but the worst highlight reel and see ifthey still want the job because expectations are clear. It's hardin general. It's hard for anybody to get behind when it's kind ofbeen just hard to find people, you know, but I think I do have agood feeling that things are starting to turn. I do feel likethere's a lot more people out there who are looking for jobs nowand a lot more wonderful people. feel much more positive about itthan I haven't in a long time here. So I think it's a good
for everybody to be okay with sacking up a little bitmore and feeling okay with that and being more straightforwardabout that. I think it's a hard thing for anybody to do in life ingeneral. It's not really my personality, but I think it's importantto go ahead and do that for the greater good there. For sure.Again, this quote, I do know this was from Keith Cunningham and hesaid, as a CEO, do your job.
And that has like hit me like a knife because whileDave, yes, that is not fun. It's not a fun conversation for anyoneto have as a CEO, as an owner, as an office manager, people thatare interviewing that are hiring. It is your job to make sure youhire and hire really well. So yes, it's an uncomfortableconversation, but that uncomfortable conversation is going to weedout a ton of people that wouldn't have lasted anyway. And I don'tlike to band -aid approach of like, let's just get somebody in andhave a body versus it being.
The Dental A Team (49:27.246)
No, I want somebody who's here with me for the nextfive years and they're going to like go through the highs and thelows and they're going to be awesome. So I think you've just likepivoted on so many fun ideas, Dave of like number one, the priorityscheduling guys. So building that schedule out with doctor, officemanager, associate, making sure that you guys build an idealschedule and then having kind of the parameters for your frontoffice of how often do we hold these blocks and when we need to doa pivot change, for example, that 8 a patient who needs thosefilling times at 8 a
to be able to shift those blocks around and reallyviewing the schedule like a puzzle and we're trying to fit perfectpuzzle pieces and realizing we're ninja it, love the patient. Thengoing into same day treatment and how you're able to do that, let'ssay yes more often and look for that. Then going into hygiene andholding those hygiene new patient blocks. So get those new patientand SRP blocks in there. Let's make sure we have space to get thatperio and also having the mindset
Hey, if I can do this, let's do it today. Let me findways that I could say yes to maximize this patient's time in mychair time. And then moving all the way into making sure you havethe right team that has that same mindset with you. And yes,culture shifts are not easy. You might today be like, I want tohave the practice like Dave, but I'm not there. Dave, I know youwould attest to this. Dave's not there. You didn't start herethough. not there. You didn't start there. Dave's not there yet.It's a work in progress.
And I love I always feel like I listen to podcasts alot of time, like, my God, this person has to figure out. No,that's not the thing. Like, you know, I'll give you bits andpieces. There's a lot of stuff that is not good. But the point is,if I shared that, like as the only things we shared, this would bea very like depressing podcast. At the end of the day, you know,you want to go ahead and like share what to aspire for, what'sworked out well. knowing like, look, at end of the day, there'sit's hard for
Like, and there's a lot more that goes into things.And you know, you could sit here and you could listen to Kiera andmyself for the last 40 minutes or whatever and think like, my God,like, you know, be able to all figure it out. No, nobody does. No,they don't. Don't try and get better. Exactly. And that's what Iwas trying to paint the picture of Dave didn't start here threeyears ago. This has been a work in progress the whole time. Andwhat I would hope is you guys at least start somewhere today, startmaking your tomorrow's better by some of these tips that we have. Idon't care what you choose to implement. I don't care how youchoose to implement.
The Dental A Team (51:44.61)
I don't care if you choose to implement this quarteror if you put it off to the next quarter, but I just would say makesure you have it scheduled with yourself, make your practice betterand do something. Because every day, like Dave said, it's a work inprogress every day, but let's make sure we're progressing towardswhere we want to go rather than just staying stagnant, which isultimately going backwards. So Dave, I love your mind. I love thatyou are a dentist, that you'll share these things. I love that
as dentists are willing to put in the hard work andactually show up and do your job. I think it's very inspiring and Ilove having on the podcast. You inspire me. So thank you, Dave, asalways. I just truly appreciate you. Thank you. I appreciate you alot too. This has been wonderful. Awesome. All right, guys. Well, Iencourage each of you to take something today, go implement it,make your tomorrow a better, better than it is today. And asalways, thanks for listening and I'll catch you next time on theDental A Team Podcast.
The Dental A Team (52:37.582)
That wraps it up for another episode of the Dental ATeam Podcast. Thank you so much for listening and we'll talk to younext time.
